I am not fond of Jamie W's work. I feel sorry for him being from two of the most outstanding artists in USA. I think your work is influenced by Richard Schmid, another master. Am I right?
I am doing still life now for a solo in September. Then I am back to farm painting in the Ukraine. I was there 10 years ago and it was time travel. Those are the toughest people I have ever encountered.
They still farm with 19c. methods. Plus I want to honor the area I was in before it may be decimated.
I collect my favorite artists on Pinterest. Please look at them under Cindy Overall. I think you will enjoy.
I've spent my life learning about and practicing archival painting materials and techniques. My copy of Ralph Mayers' "The Artist's Handbook" that I purchased in 1979 is so marked and worn that some pages are falling out. As are the updated volumes. So I'm no stranger to correct practices.
For instance, for a long time you would have been chided for painting with oil paint on an acrylic primer, and considered not to be a serious artist if you didn't paint on lead primed linen using Flake white. Thankfully, technology and time have proven that to simply be an opinion of taste, not science. Acrylic primer is a good, toothed ground for both oils, and acrylics.
Masonite does not stay "as is forever", I can promise you that. I have pieces painted on masonite of my own from back in the 70s that have started to "dust" off around the edges. I've seen plenty of paintings from 30-50 years before that, painted on masonite that are falling apart, and or with corners busted. For instance, wood products are Full of acidic compounds from the wood pulp itself, and from the glue used in it's construction, that can cause damage to the board itself, and to the paint. I assume that you are sealing the wood with a barrier size to prevent the acids from leaching into the surface of the acrylic primer, which can then transfer into the oil paint itself, causing burning and deterioration? Wood products also absorb moisture from the atmosphere and swell, contracting and expanding over time, causing issues with the adhesion and surface of the paint. Most old paintings painted on wood panels have cracked as the wood ages and also becomes more britle, or bug eaten. There are ways to help prevent these things, cradling, thicker wood panels, adhering fabric to the surface to help keep it stable, then priming that... and more.
The most archival way to paint is to use an inert substrate like ACM, aluminum composite panel. They can be properly prepared and primed with either an oil or an acrylic ground, and are entirely inert. However, if it's a very large painting, the aluminum needs to be braced with aluminum or wood bracing affixed to the back so it is stable. There are methods to do that. This is what every conservator that I know, or that I've read about, recommends now. They can be purchased from places like Artefex, or you can purchase the ACM from sign shops, as an example.
Painting on a smooth surface or a fabric surface is a matter of taste. I paint on both. The materials we paint on should be considered, but so should the artists desire to be free to create in the way they would like to. Not that I ever would, or would suggest it, but the last big Wyeth show I saw included 8' tall Jamie Wyeth paintings painted with gouache on unprepared corrugated cardboard! Seems a little nuts, but those were in a museum and being taken care of, obviously.
For the acrylic painting that I wrote about, it is not an oil painting, and because of the size it is and shipping that size painting across the country, it's not economical for me to paint on a panel, crate and ship it. I did that with a similar size painting and my cost was almost $2000.00 between framing it, crating it, shipping and insuring it. I'm confident that I can ship the rolled acrylic painting (as per these directions from Golden Artist Colors) https://justpaint.org/rolling-acrylic-paintings-for-shipping-or-storage/, and have no damage. On the other end is a knowledgable and competent framer who will restretch it properly with little to no stress on the painting, again, it's an acrylic. Acrylics have their own issues, but becoming brittle in the short time it will be in transit while rolled up, isn't one of them. That's the point of what I wrote about. I chose acrylic for this piece because of having to ship it that distance.
I've had many discussions with artists, and conservationists (one being Michael Skalka, head of the board of the ASTM, previously head of Conservation at the National Gallery) over the years about archival practices. If we let that bog us down too much, it begins to intercept creativity and the practice itself. Do everything you can to be sure you're taking the best practices steps that you know of, but let's not worry about it to the point of interupting the process of being an artist.
Thanks for your comments. It's a topic that may continue here because it's loaded on so many sides with information and misconception.
Wow!!! You are very knowledgeable about your materials. And I agree with everything except masonite.
I put two layers of gesso ( which is basic acrylic too) on the raw side, and then the acrylic paint.
I have been doing it since I was 30 and I am now 71 and all are well.
Henk Helmantel , the only living artist in the Rijks does exactly what I do. Please Google him.
I received my MFA in Florence at a grad. school that specialized in restoration. So we are both well versed.
Logically, which moves?... Which is why museums have climate control. Canvas keeps restorers in business. Mr. Baumgartner could not have his videos without canvases.
As you know, Giotto, Cimabue, Martini, etc. of the 13c. painted icons on panels. And they are still absolutely perfect.
If you are comfortable with canvas, then you should continue. I prefer a hard smooth surface.
Mailing paintings is horrific in costs. I quit that years ago. If I can't drive then they don't go.
Have you or are you fortunate enough to see the Vermeer exhibition now at the Rijks?
It is so wonderful to see people of the globe absorb the highest of classical beauty which is synonymous with truth and God.
Thanks for the great photos. Wondering if there is any Canadian outlet where I can find that linen. So disappointed in one place that sent me cradled linen with rippling! Still waiting for costumer service which seems to be a long lost art.
More to say..I live in Ky. Not many artists.
So it's great to talk to a painter.
I am not fond of Jamie W's work. I feel sorry for him being from two of the most outstanding artists in USA. I think your work is influenced by Richard Schmid, another master. Am I right?
I am doing still life now for a solo in September. Then I am back to farm painting in the Ukraine. I was there 10 years ago and it was time travel. Those are the toughest people I have ever encountered.
They still farm with 19c. methods. Plus I want to honor the area I was in before it may be decimated.
I collect my favorite artists on Pinterest. Please look at them under Cindy Overall. I think you will enjoy.
Hello Marc,
I highly recommend using primed masonite or oil board instead of canvas.
Canvas moves for many reasons and cracklure eventually happens which restorers love.
Masonite stays as is forever and is really cheap. Use a roller for thinly applied gesso to get a matte finish.
Then lightly sand. I put a red acrylic base on that is the same as the base for gold leaf with the same effect.
For me, I don't like seeing any weave underneath.
Masonite can also be cut to any size unlike stretchers.
It comes in 1/4 or 1/8 ply.
And taking canvas off, rolling and restretching is really hard on dried oils because the tension is different.
Henk Helmantel, the great Dutch painter always uses masonite.
Good luck and I love your work!
Cindy O.
Hi Cindy...
I've spent my life learning about and practicing archival painting materials and techniques. My copy of Ralph Mayers' "The Artist's Handbook" that I purchased in 1979 is so marked and worn that some pages are falling out. As are the updated volumes. So I'm no stranger to correct practices.
For instance, for a long time you would have been chided for painting with oil paint on an acrylic primer, and considered not to be a serious artist if you didn't paint on lead primed linen using Flake white. Thankfully, technology and time have proven that to simply be an opinion of taste, not science. Acrylic primer is a good, toothed ground for both oils, and acrylics.
Masonite does not stay "as is forever", I can promise you that. I have pieces painted on masonite of my own from back in the 70s that have started to "dust" off around the edges. I've seen plenty of paintings from 30-50 years before that, painted on masonite that are falling apart, and or with corners busted. For instance, wood products are Full of acidic compounds from the wood pulp itself, and from the glue used in it's construction, that can cause damage to the board itself, and to the paint. I assume that you are sealing the wood with a barrier size to prevent the acids from leaching into the surface of the acrylic primer, which can then transfer into the oil paint itself, causing burning and deterioration? Wood products also absorb moisture from the atmosphere and swell, contracting and expanding over time, causing issues with the adhesion and surface of the paint. Most old paintings painted on wood panels have cracked as the wood ages and also becomes more britle, or bug eaten. There are ways to help prevent these things, cradling, thicker wood panels, adhering fabric to the surface to help keep it stable, then priming that... and more.
The most archival way to paint is to use an inert substrate like ACM, aluminum composite panel. They can be properly prepared and primed with either an oil or an acrylic ground, and are entirely inert. However, if it's a very large painting, the aluminum needs to be braced with aluminum or wood bracing affixed to the back so it is stable. There are methods to do that. This is what every conservator that I know, or that I've read about, recommends now. They can be purchased from places like Artefex, or you can purchase the ACM from sign shops, as an example.
Painting on a smooth surface or a fabric surface is a matter of taste. I paint on both. The materials we paint on should be considered, but so should the artists desire to be free to create in the way they would like to. Not that I ever would, or would suggest it, but the last big Wyeth show I saw included 8' tall Jamie Wyeth paintings painted with gouache on unprepared corrugated cardboard! Seems a little nuts, but those were in a museum and being taken care of, obviously.
For the acrylic painting that I wrote about, it is not an oil painting, and because of the size it is and shipping that size painting across the country, it's not economical for me to paint on a panel, crate and ship it. I did that with a similar size painting and my cost was almost $2000.00 between framing it, crating it, shipping and insuring it. I'm confident that I can ship the rolled acrylic painting (as per these directions from Golden Artist Colors) https://justpaint.org/rolling-acrylic-paintings-for-shipping-or-storage/, and have no damage. On the other end is a knowledgable and competent framer who will restretch it properly with little to no stress on the painting, again, it's an acrylic. Acrylics have their own issues, but becoming brittle in the short time it will be in transit while rolled up, isn't one of them. That's the point of what I wrote about. I chose acrylic for this piece because of having to ship it that distance.
I've had many discussions with artists, and conservationists (one being Michael Skalka, head of the board of the ASTM, previously head of Conservation at the National Gallery) over the years about archival practices. If we let that bog us down too much, it begins to intercept creativity and the practice itself. Do everything you can to be sure you're taking the best practices steps that you know of, but let's not worry about it to the point of interupting the process of being an artist.
Thanks for your comments. It's a topic that may continue here because it's loaded on so many sides with information and misconception.
Ok...Marc, Now I can answer.
Wow!!! You are very knowledgeable about your materials. And I agree with everything except masonite.
I put two layers of gesso ( which is basic acrylic too) on the raw side, and then the acrylic paint.
I have been doing it since I was 30 and I am now 71 and all are well.
Henk Helmantel , the only living artist in the Rijks does exactly what I do. Please Google him.
I received my MFA in Florence at a grad. school that specialized in restoration. So we are both well versed.
Logically, which moves?... Which is why museums have climate control. Canvas keeps restorers in business. Mr. Baumgartner could not have his videos without canvases.
As you know, Giotto, Cimabue, Martini, etc. of the 13c. painted icons on panels. And they are still absolutely perfect.
If you are comfortable with canvas, then you should continue. I prefer a hard smooth surface.
Mailing paintings is horrific in costs. I quit that years ago. If I can't drive then they don't go.
Have you or are you fortunate enough to see the Vermeer exhibition now at the Rijks?
It is so wonderful to see people of the globe absorb the highest of classical beauty which is synonymous with truth and God.
Keep up your beautiful work!
Cindy O.
Marc, I just sent you a reply but it didn't go through. I am not good with social media.
Is there another way that I may respond? I wish I could copy it and send it because it is long.
Thank you for your long and thoughtful answer.
Cindy O.
Thanks for the great photos. Wondering if there is any Canadian outlet where I can find that linen. So disappointed in one place that sent me cradled linen with rippling! Still waiting for costumer service which seems to be a long lost art.